I've been doing the bleach solution (1 tablespoon per gallon of warm water)
since I started brewing and I have never had an infected beer. So in terms
of sanitation, that seems to be working fine.

What I do think I am getting are off flavors from the bleach.

Here is my procedure:
I sanitize my carboys for 30-40 minutes with this solution and then rinse it
out with cold water and allow to drip dry on my carboy stand on top of a
clean kitchen towel.

I use the same solution to sanitize my bottles using a pump spray attachment
to my bottle tree. Three squirts and I let the bottles drip dry. These are
NOT rinsed, though and when I am ready to fill, I just shake out any
residual sanitizer from the bottle and then fill em up. Should I be rinsing
out my bottles, too?

What do you use to sanitize?

Joe Murphy wrote:[color=blue]
> I've been doing the bleach solution (1 tablespoon per gallon of warm water)
> since I started brewing and I have never had an infected beer. So in terms
> of sanitation, that seems to be working fine.
>
> What I do think I am getting are off flavors from the bleach.
>
> Here is my procedure:
> I sanitize my carboys for 30-40 minutes with this solution and then rinse it
> out with cold water and allow to drip dry on my carboy stand on top of a
> clean kitchen towel.
>[/color]
This sounds good, except when I used bleach, I rinsed with hot water a
few times and then let dry. The theory being that the hot water will
dissipate the chlorine better, beside it dries faster.
[color=blue]
> I use the same solution to sanitize my bottles using a pump spray attachment
> to my bottle tree. Three squirts and I let the bottles drip dry. These are
> NOT rinsed, though and when I am ready to fill, I just shake out any
> residual sanitizer from the bottle and then fill em up. Should I be rinsing
> out my bottles, too?
>[/color]
These should also be rinsed out,a couple times, again I would use hot water.
[color=blue]
> What do you use to sanitize?
>[/color]
I have both PBW, for cleaning, and a one step, no rinse (that I actually
rinse out), "Oxyclean" type sanitizer. (B-Brite I think) I used to use
bleach, but had a batch go bad, so I stopped. Besides I can use the PBW
on my stainless and not worry about ruining it.
Cheers,

--
Michael Herrenbruck
Herrenbruck Brewery

Joe Murphy wrote:

<snip>
[color=blue]
> What do you use to sanitize?[/color]

I recently used Iodophor for the first time after 20 years of brewing.
With its ease of use and lack of off flavors imparted to the beer if not
drained completely, I kept thinking "where have you been my entire
life?" :-)
--
Bill

"Wise fool"
Gandalf, THE TWO TOWERS
-- The Wise will remove 'se' to reply; the Foolish will not--

Trouble with bleach is its designed to cling to your u-bend...... Much
better to use one made for the job that rinses easier.

"Joe Murphy" <spamthis@spam.com> wrote in message
news:-e6dnauDgvJXRW_YnZ2dnUVZ_tyinZ2d@rcn.net...[color=blue]
> I've been doing the bleach solution (1 tablespoon per gallon of warm
> water) since I started brewing and I have never had an infected beer. So
> in terms of sanitation, that seems to be working fine.
>
> What I do think I am getting are off flavors from the bleach.
>
> Here is my procedure:
> I sanitize my carboys for 30-40 minutes with this solution and then rinse
> it out with cold water and allow to drip dry on my carboy stand on top of
> a clean kitchen towel.
>
> I use the same solution to sanitize my bottles using a pump spray
> attachment to my bottle tree. Three squirts and I let the bottles drip
> dry. These are NOT rinsed, though and when I am ready to fill, I just
> shake out any residual sanitizer from the bottle and then fill em up.
> Should I be rinsing out my bottles, too?
>
> What do you use to sanitize?
>[/color]

On Mon, 12 Mar 2007 16:38:04 -0000, "JR" <John@UNSPAMsynectixltd.com>
wrote:
[color=blue]
>Trouble with bleach is its designed to cling to your u-bend...... Much
>better to use one made for the job that rinses easier.
>
>"Joe Murphy" <spamthis@spam.com> wrote in message
>news:-e6dnauDgvJXRW_YnZ2dnUVZ_tyinZ2d@rcn.net...[color=green]
>> I've been doing the bleach solution (1 tablespoon per gallon of warm
>> water) since I started brewing and I have never had an infected beer. So
>> in terms of sanitation, that seems to be working fine.
>>
>> What I do think I am getting are off flavors from the bleach.
>>
>> Here is my procedure:
>> I sanitize my carboys for 30-40 minutes with this solution and then rinse
>> it out with cold water and allow to drip dry on my carboy stand on top of
>> a clean kitchen towel.
>>
>> I use the same solution to sanitize my bottles using a pump spray
>> attachment to my bottle tree. Three squirts and I let the bottles drip
>> dry. These are NOT rinsed, though and when I am ready to fill, I just
>> shake out any residual sanitizer from the bottle and then fill em up.
>> Should I be rinsing out my bottles, too?
>>
>> What do you use to sanitize?
>>[/color]
>[/color]
The real trouble with using bleach is that it needs to be rinsed.
Unless you are using freshly boiled water to rinse with, you are
basically negating the point of using the bleach in the first place.

> The real trouble with using bleach is that it needs to be rinsed.[color=blue]
> Unless you are using freshly boiled water to rinse with, you are
> basically negating the point of using the bleach in the first place.[/color]

Rinsing isn't really a problem for most homebrewers. I've used bleach
for years and rinsed with municiple water with no problems, ever (many
different locales thus far).

Most people's tap water is treated and has practically no "beer-harmful"
microbes in it. Well water users are a different matter.

Anyway, sanitization just stacks the deck in favor of your yeast against
any competitiors. NOTHING we use removes all beasties (unless you
autoclave/pressure cook).

So, unless you have proven that your tap water is high in beer spoiling
microbes, I recommend that you rinse and don't worry (RDWHAHB).

Derric

On Tue, 13 Mar 2007 17:52:07 -0000, Derric
<derric1961@removethis.yahoo.com> wrote:
[color=blue][color=green]
>> The real trouble with using bleach is that it needs to be rinsed.
>> Unless you are using freshly boiled water to rinse with, you are
>> basically negating the point of using the bleach in the first place.[/color]
>
>Rinsing isn't really a problem for most homebrewers. I've used bleach
>for years and rinsed with municiple water with no problems, ever (many
>different locales thus far).
>
>Most people's tap water is treated and has practically no "beer-harmful"
>microbes in it. Well water users are a different matter.
>
>Anyway, sanitization just stacks the deck in favor of your yeast against
>any competitiors. NOTHING we use removes all beasties (unless you
>autoclave/pressure cook).
>
>So, unless you have proven that your tap water is high in beer spoiling
>microbes, I recommend that you rinse and don't worry (RDWHAHB).
>
>Derric[/color]

This debate has been ongoing for years and isn't going to end with you
and I. I don't rinse, but then again I don't use bleach. I've NEVER
used bleach. I've used iodophor since I started brewing. I love the
fact that it sanitizes much quicker and does not have to be rinsed.

[color=blue]
> This debate has been ongoing for years and isn't going to end with you
> and I.[/color]

Agreed... I didn't want to start/continue the debate ... I just wanted
to let the original poster know that tap water rinses are used by a lot
of people and don't pose any undue infection risk in most locations.

[color=blue]
> I don't rinse, but then again I don't use bleach. I've NEVER
> used bleach. I've used iodophor since I started brewing. I love the
> fact that it sanitizes much quicker and does not have to be rinsed.[/color]

I've used bleach for 18 years with absolutely no problems. HOWEVER, I
do agree that there are drawbacks to bleach that other sanitizers don't
have (but bleach has advantages too... cheap, widely available, probably
already at your house, etc.). I recently got a bottle of StarSan and I
definitely like it for the short contact time and the no rinse - both
pretty big time savers over bleach.

Derric

Joe,

I have aleways used bleach as a sanitiser & in concentrations much stronger
than you describe.
I always thoroughly rinse everything that has been in contact with bleach
solution in either hot water (we have low cost hot water thanks to a highly
efficient solar water heater) or in filtered cold water which has passed
through our underbench system (0.5 micron particle filter then over
activated charcoal).
The free flowing hot water suits me best because the flow rate is higher.
However I do not normally bother to use the bleach sanitiser method on my
bottles, perhaps an occasional bottle which I think looks dirty or where I
can see a hint of a ringmark mark inside the top.
My bottles are thoroughly washed within 12 hours of use in the hot water &
allowed to dry upside down in my bottle rack which is normally left outside
in the sun for anything up to 3 or 4 days. My theory is that the Queensland
sun is strong enough to sanitise anything.
This works & I have never had any individual bottle taste off.
I used to occasionally get off flavours in my beer , but that was many years
ago, & whilst I never positively found the cause I believe it developed
during the brewing phase. My techniques are tighter & somewhat different
these days - no problems ever.
Except I am still chasing that elusive Heinecken taste & frankly I am still
miles away.

Pete


"Joe Murphy" <spamthis@spam.com> wrote in message
news:-e6dnauDgvJXRW_YnZ2dnUVZ_tyinZ2d@rcn.net...[color=blue]
> I've been doing the bleach solution (1 tablespoon per gallon of warm
> water) since I started brewing and I have never had an infected beer. So
> in terms of sanitation, that seems to be working fine.
>
> What I do think I am getting are off flavors from the bleach.
>
> Here is my procedure:
> I sanitize my carboys for 30-40 minutes with this solution and then rinse
> it out with cold water and allow to drip dry on my carboy stand on top of
> a clean kitchen towel.
>
> I use the same solution to sanitize my bottles using a pump spray
> attachment to my bottle tree. Three squirts and I let the bottles drip
> dry. These are NOT rinsed, though and when I am ready to fill, I just
> shake out any residual sanitizer from the bottle and then fill em up.
> Should I be rinsing out my bottles, too?
>
> What do you use to sanitize?
>[/color]

[color=blue]
> Except I am still chasing that elusive Heinecken taste & frankly I am still
> miles away.[/color]

Not to highjack this thread, but ... I tried and tried to reproduce the
taste of Pilsner Urquell. I made very good pilsners, but it was never
"quite the same."

Then one day, due to odd circumstances, I ended up leaving a bottle of
my latest attempt in the basement sink and forgot about it. That sink
gets a slight amount of morning sun only. A few days later I thought
I'd try the beer, so put it in the fridge. Not so surprisingly, it had
that elusive taste of PU.

So, at least in the US, part of the standard taste of most imported
lagers is "light skunk." I don't know how imports there are treated,
but it is difficult to get unskunked imported beer since most use green
or clear bottles and most get exposed to sunlight or florescent light.

You may want to take a bottle of your best attempt and put it in the sun
for a while. If the bottle is brown, I understand that skunking happens
FAST, so pour it up into a clear glass and let it sit in the sun.

BTW, I liked the unskunked version best after all! I imagine that it is
more like what PU would taste locally.

Derric