has anyone heard of/used ozonated water as a starilizing agent for bottles
and other equipment? the reason i ask is that i remember seeing a
documentary type thing about bottling and (i think it was pepsi) that uses
ozonated water to starilize their cans before filling them with product.

anyway, if anyone has any information as to the effectiveness and
suitability of this method of sterilization to brewing, please let me know.

-Sam

"Sam Anderson" <voltaic@ou.edu> wrote in message
news:Xns94939E16524ABvoltaicouedu@68.12.19.6...[color=blue]
> has anyone heard of/used ozonated water as a starilizing agent for bottles
> and other equipment? the reason i ask is that i remember seeing a
> documentary type thing about bottling and (i think it was pepsi) that uses
> ozonated water to starilize their cans before filling them with product.
>
> anyway, if anyone has any information as to the effectiveness and
> suitability of this method of sterilization to brewing, please let me[/color]
know.[color=blue]
>[/color]

I remember from a few college courses that ozone (O3) is an effective
sterilant. It can be used to disinfect both drinking water and treated
sewage. But, it is not widely used because it is very expensive.

As a homebrewer, I can't imagine it being a cheap or practical method. You
could probably find it from an indutrial gas supplier, but I doubt that you
would be able to walk into a gas supply shop and purchase a 10 pound
cylindar of the stuff. The samllest cylindar available would probably be
100+ pounds.

Also, I don't think you could buy ozonated water. It was a long time ago
since those sanitary engineering courses, but I think the ozone breaks down
readily into regular oygen (O2). Pepsi probably has the capabilities to
ozonate water immediately prior to sanitizing their cans and bottles. Maybe
the fact that ozone breaks down into oxygen is the reason Pepsi would use
it, rather than having to deal with residual chemicals.

"Glenn L." <lango77@ADJUNCTS.optonline.net> wrote in message
news:ZTUYb.8750399$Of.1427628@news.easynews.com...[color=blue]
>
> "Sam Anderson" <voltaic@ou.edu> wrote in message
> news:Xns94939E16524ABvoltaicouedu@68.12.19.6...[color=green]
> > has anyone heard of/used ozonated water as a starilizing agent for[/color][/color]
bottles[color=blue][color=green]
> > and other equipment? the reason i ask is that i remember seeing a
> > documentary type thing about bottling and (i think it was pepsi) that[/color][/color]
uses[color=blue][color=green]
> > ozonated water to starilize their cans before filling them with product.
> >
> > anyway, if anyone has any information as to the effectiveness and
> > suitability of this method of sterilization to brewing, please let me[/color]
> know.[color=green]
> >[/color]
>
> I remember from a few college courses that ozone (O3) is an effective
> sterilant. It can be used to disinfect both drinking water and treated
> sewage. But, it is not widely used because it is very expensive.
>
> As a homebrewer, I can't imagine it being a cheap or practical method.[/color]
You[color=blue]
> could probably find it from an indutrial gas supplier, but I doubt that[/color]
you[color=blue]
> would be able to walk into a gas supply shop and purchase a 10 pound
> cylindar of the stuff. The samllest cylindar available would probably be
> 100+ pounds.
>
> Also, I don't think you could buy ozonated water. It was a long time ago
> since those sanitary engineering courses, but I think the ozone breaks[/color]
down[color=blue]
> readily into regular oygen (O2). Pepsi probably has the capabilities to
> ozonate water immediately prior to sanitizing their cans and bottles.[/color]
Maybe[color=blue]
> the fact that ozone breaks down into oxygen is the reason Pepsi would use
> it, rather than having to deal with residual chemicals.
>[/color]

You may be surprised to know that many municipal water systems now use ozone
as their primary treatment in place of chlorine. My local water district
(serving almost 2 million residents) expect to complete its conversion to
ozone by 2007. It's not as uncommon as you think. You can buy home ozone
generators for air treatment for as little as $200. Small systems capable
of treating water at 10 gal/min are also available, as well as systems for
treating home well water. Do a quick Google search for "ozone water
treatment."

Also, you don't have to "buy" bottled ozone. Its reactive and unstable.
You generate it from air or oxygen (O2). My HotSprings hot tub has an
ozone generator that is used to treat the water in place of low level
chlorine. Works great, and has run for 4 years with no maintenance.

"CSS" <nospam@ix.netcom.invalid> wrote in message
news:5MWYb.9680$tL3.4333@newsread1.news.pas.earthlink.net...[color=blue]
>
> "Glenn L." <lango77@ADJUNCTS.optonline.net> wrote in message
> news:ZTUYb.8750399$Of.1427628@news.easynews.com...[color=green]
> >
> > "Sam Anderson" <voltaic@ou.edu> wrote in message
> > news:Xns94939E16524ABvoltaicouedu@68.12.19.6...[/color][/color]
[snip][color=blue]
>
> You may be surprised to know that many municipal water systems now use[/color]
ozone[color=blue]
> as their primary treatment in place of chlorine. My local water district
> (serving almost 2 million residents) expect to complete its conversion to
> ozone by 2007. It's not as uncommon as you think. You can buy home ozone
> generators for air treatment for as little as $200. Small systems[/color]
capable[color=blue]
> of treating water at 10 gal/min are also available, as well as systems for
> treating home well water. Do a quick Google search for "ozone water
> treatment."
>
> Also, you don't have to "buy" bottled ozone. Its reactive and unstable.
> You generate it from air or oxygen (O2). My HotSprings hot tub has an
> ozone generator that is used to treat the water in place of low level
> chlorine. Works great, and has run for 4 years with no maintenance.
>
>[/color]

It has been a long time since those college courses, so I am not surprised
that the technology has advanced to this point. I wasn't aware of the
changes.

Getting back to the original post, would this be a viable option for
sanitizing brewing hardware? It sounds like ozone generators are able to
sanitize water effectively (probably helpful to rinse chlorine from a
carboy). But, could you pump the ozone into a carboy or bottle and get the
same effect?

"Glenn L." <lango77@ADJUNCTS.optonline.net> wrote in message
news:ZgXYb.599653$9p3.112390@news.easynews.com...[color=blue]
>
> "CSS" <nospam@ix.netcom.invalid> wrote in message
> news:5MWYb.9680$tL3.4333@newsread1.news.pas.earthlink.net...[color=green]
> >
> > "Glenn L." <lango77@ADJUNCTS.optonline.net> wrote in message
> > news:ZTUYb.8750399$Of.1427628@news.easynews.com...[color=darkred]
> > >
> > > "Sam Anderson" <voltaic@ou.edu> wrote in message
> > > news:Xns94939E16524ABvoltaicouedu@68.12.19.6...[/color][/color]
> [snip][color=green]
> >
> > You may be surprised to know that many municipal water systems now use[/color]
> ozone[color=green]
> > as their primary treatment in place of chlorine. My local water[/color][/color]
district[color=blue][color=green]
> > (serving almost 2 million residents) expect to complete its conversion[/color][/color]
to[color=blue][color=green]
> > ozone by 2007. It's not as uncommon as you think. You can buy home[/color][/color]
ozone[color=blue][color=green]
> > generators for air treatment for as little as $200. Small systems[/color]
> capable[color=green]
> > of treating water at 10 gal/min are also available, as well as systems[/color][/color]
for[color=blue][color=green]
> > treating home well water. Do a quick Google search for "ozone water
> > treatment."
> >
> > Also, you don't have to "buy" bottled ozone. Its reactive and unstable.
> > You generate it from air or oxygen (O2). My HotSprings hot tub has an
> > ozone generator that is used to treat the water in place of low level
> > chlorine. Works great, and has run for 4 years with no maintenance.
> >
> >[/color]
>
> It has been a long time since those college courses, so I am not surprised
> that the technology has advanced to this point. I wasn't aware of the
> changes.
>
> Getting back to the original post, would this be a viable option for
> sanitizing brewing hardware? It sounds like ozone generators are able to
> sanitize water effectively (probably helpful to rinse chlorine from a
> carboy). But, could you pump the ozone into a carboy or bottle and get[/color]
the[color=blue]
> same effect?
>[/color]
Yes, it is certainly possible. The small scale water treatment systems
first inject ozone into a water holding tank to sanitize, then do the
remaining treatments before use. One could adapt a small generating system
to ozonate a tank of water for use in brewing. The major issue would
probably be the cost, probably a few hundred to a thousand dollars for a
commercial system. But, as homebrewers are resourceful, there may be ways
to adapt lower-cost solutions or even make or put together a small-scale
system for much less.

Sam Anderson wrote:[color=blue]
>
> has anyone heard of/used ozonated water as a starilizing agent for bottles
> and other equipment? the reason i ask is that i remember seeing a
> documentary type thing about bottling and (i think it was pepsi) that uses
> ozonated water to starilize their cans before filling them with product.
>
> anyway, if anyone has any information as to the effectiveness and
> suitability of this method of sterilization to brewing, please let me know.[/color]

I looked into it a coule years ago. Not only does it not seem to be as
effective as other sanitizers, I could buy Iodophor for longer than the
rest of my life before I amortized the cost of a unit!

---------->Denny
--
Life begins at 60 - 1.060, that is.

Reply to denny_at_projectoneaudio_dot_com

<SNIP>
But, as homebrewers are resourceful, there may be ways[color=blue]
> to adapt lower-cost solutions or even make or put together a small-scale
> system for much less.
>
>[/color]
there is a patent about a small scale ozone generator... i dont remember the
number but a search on [url]www.espacenet.com[/url] should turn it up. The main
requirement is a generator which generates a highfrequency highvoltage
signal.. some kiloHerz and kiloVolts.. I wouldn't recommend that if you have
kids in the house....

And there's nothing in your house right now that generates a high voltage
high frequency signal? like a television? or a computer monitor?

About 15 years ago, I worked for a company where we designed and built our
own ozone generators for use in depositing semiconductor thin films.
Toughest part was finding materials that could stand up to long-term ozone
exposure. We were well-versed in RF design and usage, and the rest was
easy...


"Nixje" <nixje_2000@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:4034fa74$0$93699$cd19a363@news.wanadoo.nl...[color=blue]
> <SNIP>
> But, as homebrewers are resourceful, there may be ways[color=green]
> > to adapt lower-cost solutions or even make or put together a small-scale
> > system for much less.
> >
> >[/color]
> there is a patent about a small scale ozone generator... i dont remember[/color]
the[color=blue]
> number but a search on [url]www.espacenet.com[/url] should turn it up. The main
> requirement is a generator which generates a highfrequency highvoltage
> signal.. some kiloHerz and kiloVolts.. I wouldn't recommend that if you[/color]
have[color=blue]
> kids in the house....
>
>[/color]